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An interview with Grade 11 high school students Kedimetse Mapori and Lerato Tebele by Dale McKinley and Ahmed Veriava.
An interview with Grade 11 high school students Kedimetse Mapori and Lerato Tebele by Dale McKinley and Ahmed Veriava.
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Project name: Alternative History Project
Date of interview: 2007-06-09
Location of interview: Maandagshoek, Limpopo
Language of interview: Sotho
Name of Interviewer/s: Dale McKinley & Ahmed Veriava
Name of Interviewee/s: Kedimetse Mapori & Lerato Tebele
Name of translator: Emmanuel Mokgoga
Name of transcriber: Moses Moremi
Audio file name: AHP_MAA_MaporoKedimetseTebeleLerato_20070609 INTERVIEW WITH KEDIMETSE MAPORI & LERATO TEBELE
Dale Mckinley (DM): Can you tell us both your name and your surname please?
Kedimetse Mapori (KM): My name is Kedimetse Mapori.
DM: And your name is?
Lerato Lorraine Tebele (LLT): My name is Lerato Lorraine Tebele.
DM: I think you have heard we said quite a number of things but I'm going to ask you specific questions, yes. What is it now that both of you are doing? Are you students, unemployed, what is your situation now?
LLT: We are students.
DM: You are students?
LLT: Yes.
DM: What school do you go to?
LLT: Phuthineo Secondary School.
DM: Secondary, what grade are you in?
LLT: Grade 11.
DM: And you?
KM: Grade 11.
DM: Tell us something about the education in the last several years now you have been, if you are in grade 11 then in 1994 you were what, 7 years old/ 6/7 years old? In 1994 how old were you?
LLT: We were 7 years old.
DM: Since you were 7 in your primary school and you are in secondary school, tell us something about your schooling? Has it been good/bad? Do you like the teachers? Do you think you are getting a good education here? What's the problem? It is good things or bad things?
LLT: I have never encountered any problem on my education. It was very good because there were text books, I used to read on and actually I was not attending here. I was attending in Tembisa but even here teachers are lazy to teach but they provide us with text books to study for ourselves.
KM: I think our schools are poor, even the environment is not good and if you visit them now you will think maybe it has been used long ago.
DM: Right now your teachers are on strike?
Both: Yes.
DM: What do you think of that?
KM: Our government doesn't want to give them money and those top officials get well paid.
LLT: And they are staying in the very expensive shelters which they pay every month and they have food to eat.
DM: What kinds of things here as young people would you like to see happening in your community?
LLT: Eeee, Eish we wish they could build tarred roads and stop telling us lies, fooling our parents to get their farms which we get our food from. And even the platinum which they are talking about here is not theirs and that is for us to decide what to do with it so that we can get food. They should build better houses and schools for us.
KM: In fact we don't need Motsepe or Anglo in our land. We can do the mining for ourselves if we can get the license and people invest in us. All we want is that the government should educate us to know how to do the mining or sell our crops at the corporation. Companies that want to mine here should negotiate with us not to betray us and they should stop working individually. What I know is that it is wrong to go to Pretoria at Motsepe's place or Sello Moloto and started mining, they won't like that and you can even get arrested.
DM: You are now going to be in matric next year?
Both: Yes.
DM: What do you see for the future ... for yourselves? What would you want to do? What kind of things or who do you want to be? What kind of work do you want to do?
LLT: I want to be a wise person who loves her community and knows where I come from so that I can help where there are sufferings. I can see my community is suffering so I want to improve myself through school and be able to help my community.
KM: I would love to be a Private Investigator so that we can arrest all these corrupt presidents. They are rich in a corrupt way and people should be returned their wealth.
DM: What do you think is going to be needed for you to be able to do that, in other words who do you need to get support from? Where do you need support from in order to realise your dreams for what you want to do?
KM: We can get support from our government. If the government can provide us with bursaries and those bursaries should cover us all. Now Anglo is giving bursaries to the townships forgetting where they are making money. The problem here is many people do not further their education after passing matric because of lack of bursaries.
LLT: No further education.
DM: Further education, do you want to go to university?
LLT: Yes.
DM: And you need bursaries for that?
LLT: Yes.
DM: So government is to help?
LLT: Yes.
AV: If you were going to go to university what would you study?
LLT: I want to study Physics and Maths Biology.
AV: And yourself?
KM: I want to be a Private Investigator but I don't have more information about that course.
DM: One of the things that we are trying to find out here is what kinds of information that you need to improve your lives most. Like many people in Johannesburg (in Soweto) the students have access to information, information they need to get jobs. What kind of information do you need here in order to improve things both for yourselves and the community?
LLT: For us to get information, our school has to take us to the universities and show us what is happening in the open days where there would be different career guidelines.
DM: I want to ask you ... this Modikwe mine, Patrice Motsepe, African Rainbow ... he owns. You are seeing now on the television and everywhere you see lots of people in Cape Town, Durban, Johannesburg, what we call, what is called now 'Black Economic Empowerment'. People getting very wealthy, driving the big Mercedes and all those kinds of things. Do you think that's a good thing?
KM: It's not good because we are not the ones who are driving those cars. They drive those cars in the cities.
LLT: Our leaders are the ones who mislead us.
DM: Do you think it's a good thing for example, particularly people who were previously disadvantaged, to get very wealthy while your situation here as you are saying, has not changed very much?
LLT: We don't agree with that.
DM: Why?
LLT: Things needs to be shared accordingly. We have to share things 50/50.
DM: We asked a question earlier about ownership. What is it that your local municipality, your counsellor who doesn't seem to be very popular here in this community, as young people who are now looking for the future, what do you think the local municipality should be doing here in this community? These are people that you have elected, you put them there to represent the community but they seem not to be happy. The community doesn't seem to be very happy with them.
KM: The counsellors should come to us and hear what we need. The ANC should educate those counsellors on how to deal with the service delivery and know how to deal with the community in general.
DM: Do you think that areas like this in the rural area in Maandagshoek are discriminated against as opposed to urban areas ... that you don't get very much attention here in the rural areas? Why do you think that might be the case? You know you go to Nelspruit , the people that are living in the townships in Nelspruit or go to Johannesburg or you go to Polokwane but here in the rural areas no one is listening?
LLT: Those who are not living in the rural areas are the ones that ran away with our money to go and stay in Polokwane and Johannesburg. They don't want to use the money where it belongs. They don't do anything for the community.
KM: Yes this is what is happening because from long ago our minerals have been controlled by people from far. They just can't mix with illiterate people.
DM: Many elderly people in South Africa seem to be thinking that the young people have lost respect for the elders. They have lost their culture, their history; you know what I'm saying?
Both: Yes.
DM: Do you think that is the case? What we are doing now is to try to get an oral history about this community. Do you think that young people of today are too interested in listening to kwaito and just drinking and not doing anything for their community or do you think young people are serious about things today?
KM: Kwaito does not have any problem.
LLT: It depends on a person's ambition ... Kwaito does not have a problem and for that little time that you got you can listen to it.
DM: In the future, what do you see happening in the next 5 years here for yourself and this community for the next 5 years?
KM: I think we should become very much poorer, without land because Motsepe is not asking for our land he just took it. But as the youth we will try by all means to save this community and the problem is we need the national government to help us.
LLT: I don't think the police can help us. I think we should not include the police in our struggle because I think they are the ones who are helping those people to exploit us.
DM: Ok, anything else you want to say, you want to tell people, some of these recordings are going to be seen and read by lots of different people around the country. Is there anything you want to say as the youth of Maandagshoek?
KM: Oh, us as the youth of Maandagshoek ...we are the owners of this place we are asking that all people who are looking at this should come and see what Motsepe and our government has done for us.
LLT: They should come and help us to fight for our place.
KM: Motsepe took our wealth; removed us and our late grandmothers and fathers without our concern. In the future we would be unable to farm because it's seems as if Motsepe wants to take our farms.
LLT: We are no longer interested in anything for now but we want to fight for what we are left with.
DM: Thank you very much, thank you, thanks for talking to us, ok.
Both: thanks. __________________
Kedimetse Mapori & Lerato Tebele; 2007-06-09; 1
Date of interview: 2007-06-09
Location of interview: Maandagshoek, Limpopo
Language of interview: Sotho
Name of Interviewer/s: Dale McKinley & Ahmed Veriava
Name of Interviewee/s: Kedimetse Mapori & Lerato Tebele
Name of translator: Emmanuel Mokgoga
Name of transcriber: Moses Moremi
Audio file name: AHP_MAA_MaporoKedimetseTebeleLerato_20070609 INTERVIEW WITH KEDIMETSE MAPORI & LERATO TEBELE
Dale Mckinley (DM): Can you tell us both your name and your surname please?
Kedimetse Mapori (KM): My name is Kedimetse Mapori.
DM: And your name is?
Lerato Lorraine Tebele (LLT): My name is Lerato Lorraine Tebele.
DM: I think you have heard we said quite a number of things but I'm going to ask you specific questions, yes. What is it now that both of you are doing? Are you students, unemployed, what is your situation now?
LLT: We are students.
DM: You are students?
LLT: Yes.
DM: What school do you go to?
LLT: Phuthineo Secondary School.
DM: Secondary, what grade are you in?
LLT: Grade 11.
DM: And you?
KM: Grade 11.
DM: Tell us something about the education in the last several years now you have been, if you are in grade 11 then in 1994 you were what, 7 years old/ 6/7 years old? In 1994 how old were you?
LLT: We were 7 years old.
DM: Since you were 7 in your primary school and you are in secondary school, tell us something about your schooling? Has it been good/bad? Do you like the teachers? Do you think you are getting a good education here? What's the problem? It is good things or bad things?
LLT: I have never encountered any problem on my education. It was very good because there were text books, I used to read on and actually I was not attending here. I was attending in Tembisa but even here teachers are lazy to teach but they provide us with text books to study for ourselves.
KM: I think our schools are poor, even the environment is not good and if you visit them now you will think maybe it has been used long ago.
DM: Right now your teachers are on strike?
Both: Yes.
DM: What do you think of that?
KM: Our government doesn't want to give them money and those top officials get well paid.
LLT: And they are staying in the very expensive shelters which they pay every month and they have food to eat.
DM: What kinds of things here as young people would you like to see happening in your community?
LLT: Eeee, Eish we wish they could build tarred roads and stop telling us lies, fooling our parents to get their farms which we get our food from. And even the platinum which they are talking about here is not theirs and that is for us to decide what to do with it so that we can get food. They should build better houses and schools for us.
KM: In fact we don't need Motsepe or Anglo in our land. We can do the mining for ourselves if we can get the license and people invest in us. All we want is that the government should educate us to know how to do the mining or sell our crops at the corporation. Companies that want to mine here should negotiate with us not to betray us and they should stop working individually. What I know is that it is wrong to go to Pretoria at Motsepe's place or Sello Moloto and started mining, they won't like that and you can even get arrested.
DM: You are now going to be in matric next year?
Both: Yes.
DM: What do you see for the future ... for yourselves? What would you want to do? What kind of things or who do you want to be? What kind of work do you want to do?
LLT: I want to be a wise person who loves her community and knows where I come from so that I can help where there are sufferings. I can see my community is suffering so I want to improve myself through school and be able to help my community.
KM: I would love to be a Private Investigator so that we can arrest all these corrupt presidents. They are rich in a corrupt way and people should be returned their wealth.
DM: What do you think is going to be needed for you to be able to do that, in other words who do you need to get support from? Where do you need support from in order to realise your dreams for what you want to do?
KM: We can get support from our government. If the government can provide us with bursaries and those bursaries should cover us all. Now Anglo is giving bursaries to the townships forgetting where they are making money. The problem here is many people do not further their education after passing matric because of lack of bursaries.
LLT: No further education.
DM: Further education, do you want to go to university?
LLT: Yes.
DM: And you need bursaries for that?
LLT: Yes.
DM: So government is to help?
LLT: Yes.
AV: If you were going to go to university what would you study?
LLT: I want to study Physics and Maths Biology.
AV: And yourself?
KM: I want to be a Private Investigator but I don't have more information about that course.
DM: One of the things that we are trying to find out here is what kinds of information that you need to improve your lives most. Like many people in Johannesburg (in Soweto) the students have access to information, information they need to get jobs. What kind of information do you need here in order to improve things both for yourselves and the community?
LLT: For us to get information, our school has to take us to the universities and show us what is happening in the open days where there would be different career guidelines.
DM: I want to ask you ... this Modikwe mine, Patrice Motsepe, African Rainbow ... he owns. You are seeing now on the television and everywhere you see lots of people in Cape Town, Durban, Johannesburg, what we call, what is called now 'Black Economic Empowerment'. People getting very wealthy, driving the big Mercedes and all those kinds of things. Do you think that's a good thing?
KM: It's not good because we are not the ones who are driving those cars. They drive those cars in the cities.
LLT: Our leaders are the ones who mislead us.
DM: Do you think it's a good thing for example, particularly people who were previously disadvantaged, to get very wealthy while your situation here as you are saying, has not changed very much?
LLT: We don't agree with that.
DM: Why?
LLT: Things needs to be shared accordingly. We have to share things 50/50.
DM: We asked a question earlier about ownership. What is it that your local municipality, your counsellor who doesn't seem to be very popular here in this community, as young people who are now looking for the future, what do you think the local municipality should be doing here in this community? These are people that you have elected, you put them there to represent the community but they seem not to be happy. The community doesn't seem to be very happy with them.
KM: The counsellors should come to us and hear what we need. The ANC should educate those counsellors on how to deal with the service delivery and know how to deal with the community in general.
DM: Do you think that areas like this in the rural area in Maandagshoek are discriminated against as opposed to urban areas ... that you don't get very much attention here in the rural areas? Why do you think that might be the case? You know you go to Nelspruit , the people that are living in the townships in Nelspruit or go to Johannesburg or you go to Polokwane but here in the rural areas no one is listening?
LLT: Those who are not living in the rural areas are the ones that ran away with our money to go and stay in Polokwane and Johannesburg. They don't want to use the money where it belongs. They don't do anything for the community.
KM: Yes this is what is happening because from long ago our minerals have been controlled by people from far. They just can't mix with illiterate people.
DM: Many elderly people in South Africa seem to be thinking that the young people have lost respect for the elders. They have lost their culture, their history; you know what I'm saying?
Both: Yes.
DM: Do you think that is the case? What we are doing now is to try to get an oral history about this community. Do you think that young people of today are too interested in listening to kwaito and just drinking and not doing anything for their community or do you think young people are serious about things today?
KM: Kwaito does not have any problem.
LLT: It depends on a person's ambition ... Kwaito does not have a problem and for that little time that you got you can listen to it.
DM: In the future, what do you see happening in the next 5 years here for yourself and this community for the next 5 years?
KM: I think we should become very much poorer, without land because Motsepe is not asking for our land he just took it. But as the youth we will try by all means to save this community and the problem is we need the national government to help us.
LLT: I don't think the police can help us. I think we should not include the police in our struggle because I think they are the ones who are helping those people to exploit us.
DM: Ok, anything else you want to say, you want to tell people, some of these recordings are going to be seen and read by lots of different people around the country. Is there anything you want to say as the youth of Maandagshoek?
KM: Oh, us as the youth of Maandagshoek ...we are the owners of this place we are asking that all people who are looking at this should come and see what Motsepe and our government has done for us.
LLT: They should come and help us to fight for our place.
KM: Motsepe took our wealth; removed us and our late grandmothers and fathers without our concern. In the future we would be unable to farm because it's seems as if Motsepe wants to take our farms.
LLT: We are no longer interested in anything for now but we want to fight for what we are left with.
DM: Thank you very much, thank you, thanks for talking to us, ok.
Both: thanks. __________________
Kedimetse Mapori & Lerato Tebele; 2007-06-09; 1
Translation: Download (22 KB)
SAHA
Creator: Mapori, Kedimetse
McKinley, Dale
Tebele, Lerato
Veriava, Ahmed
McKinley, Dale
Tebele, Lerato
Veriava, Ahmed
Contributing Institutions: SAHA; MATRIX: The Center for Humane Arts, Letters and Social Sciences Online at Michigan State University
Contributors: Emmanuel Mokgoga (Translator)
Moses Moremi (Transcriber)
Moses Moremi (Transcriber)
Biography: Kedimetse Mapori and Lerato Tebele, both Grade 11 high school students at the time of the interview, were born and bred in Maandagshoek. They want to further their studies and continue to live in, and help the Maandagshoek community.
Description: This interview with Grade 11 high school students Kedimetsi Mapori and Lerato Tebele was conducted by Dale McKinley and Ahmed Veriava in Maandagshoek in 2007 as part of the South African History Archive's Alternative History Project, titled 'Forgotten Voices in the Present'.
Date: June 9, 2007
Location: Maandagshoek, Limpopo, Republic of South Africa
Format: Audio/mp3
Language: Sotho
Rights Management: For educational use only.
Digitizer: SAHA
Source: SAHA collection AL3280